Relationships Talk

Jeff Bezos and MacKenzie Bezos attend the Vanity Fair Oscar Party at Wallis Annenberg Center for the Performing Arts in Beverly Hills, Calif., last March. (dpa picture alliance / Alamy Stock Photo)

If creating and running a successful business isn’t challenging enough for many entrepreneurs, it can be mind-boggling to think about what it takes to do that and maintain a healthy personal relationship.

In the wake of news that Amazon founder and CEO Jeff Bezos and his wife of 25 years, MacKenzie Bezos, are planning to divorce, GeekWire contacted marriage experts and startup founders to better understand whether entrepreneurs and their spouses or partners have it tougher than average people do when it comes to staying together.

While the popular consensus in various reports seems to be that entrepreneurs are prone to a higher divorce rate than the roughly 40 to 50 percent of Americans who end up in that situation, there is no known research or hard data to back that up.

RELATED: The $100 billion question: What will happen to Bezos and Allen fortunes as they change hands?

Dr. Pepper Schwartz, a professor of sociology at the University of Washington, said such a study would be a “methodologically challenging thing to do” because it’s difficult to qualify who is a startup founder and where that distinction ends. If someone starts a company at 25 and divorces at 45, are they a divorced startup founder?

Schwartz, who has been at the UW for 47 years, is the author of 25 academic and popular books, including her latest, “Snap Strategies for Couples: 40 Fast Fixes for Everyday Relationship Pitfalls.” She’s also spent eight seasons on the Lifetime television docuseries “Married at First Sight.”

Neither Schwartz, nor anyone else we spoke to, knows Jeff or MacKenzie Bezos personally nor did they have any direct knowledge of any challenges the couple faced together.

Dr. Pepper Schwartz. (Photo via PepperSchwartz.com)

“First of all, Bezos stayed married 25 years. In Hollywood, that’s three lifetimes,” Schwartz said. “Give ’em credit that these two worked hard at a relationship and kept it together for what is in anybody’s books a very long time and certainly far longer than his initial startup fervor, which is often the time when everything else gets neglected but the business.”

Schwartz said there are pressure points at very different and continuing parts of a life, such as the point where you don’t know if your effort to start a business is going to pay off, or the other person is earning a living and you’re “up and down and you don’t know if you’re going to be down and out.”

The euphoria of success could also change things, especially for someone who has achieved as much as the world’s richest person.

It takes a certain type of personality to be able to do and build all that Bezos has, Schwartz said. And that personality, and the circumstances of his wealth and lifestyle, may also be what allows him to move on in a much different way than the average person.

“Not all entrepreneur’s marriages break up. Some of them come close and come back together because they realize how much they do have that they can’t build overnight with anyone else,” Schwartz said. “The difference between an entrepreneur that’s been that successful is they have endless options. People should consider what they would do with endless options where their economics wouldn’t change, their age wouldn’t make them less attractive, they would always have people who want to be with them, they’re living an extraordinary life that they could offer someone else. All of that comes into play.”

Living in separate worlds

Dr. John Gottman and Dr. Julie Schwartz Gottman. (Photo courtesy of the Gottman Institute)

Dr. John Gottman and his wife Dr. Julie Schwartz Gottman, co-founders of the Seattle-based Gottman Institute, have conducted decades of research into marital stability and divorce prediction. A professor emeritus of psychology at the University of Washington, John Gottman founded the onetime “Love Lab” at the school where he conducted much of his study on couples’ interactions.

The Gottmans said they have treated many people who are very successful entrepreneurs. They often see a very clear role delineation within families connected to successful companies like Amazon.

“What happens typically if the man is more the predominant entrepreneur is that he devotes himself completely to the business, working as much as 18 to 20 hours a day, seven days a week, and the partner or wife is often the one who is raising the children and later on taking on perhaps some responsibilities for charity work or foundational work,” Julie Gottman said. “What ends up happening is they end up diverging in terms of their world. They’re really living in two separate worlds.”

Communication, or maintaining some form of it, is vital. Julie Gottman said “rituals of connection” are a necessity to make sure partners stay in tune with each other. If that effort is not made it becomes easier to grow more and more distant and separate and take each other for granted.

“Eventually they almost become strangers to one another,” Julie Gottman said. “And that can be very painful and very lonely in a marriage.”

If a couple walked into the Gottman Institute tomorrow and one was driven to be a successful startup founder and the other had reservations about risk and finances and so on, they would first be subjected to a careful assessment by the doctors.

“It doesn’t have to do so much with a one being driven or their own personality and goals or ambition versus the other one’s fears,” Julie Gottman said. “It’s more about, how do they talk to one another? How do they share their concerns? How do they share their excitement, their ambitions, their hopes? How do they manage conflict together and how do they maintain their intimacy and their friendship?”

Family has to be all in

Moment founder Marc Barros. (GeekWire Photo Kurt Schlosser)

Marc Barros started his first company, Contour, in 2003 at the University of Washington and got fired from the action video camera maker the same year he got married, in 2012. He and his wife, Gina, took a year off together before Barros started Moment, creators of smartphone cases and camera lenses, in 2013.

Six years and three kids — ages 1, 3, and 5 — later, Barros reflected on his entrepreneurial journey and how he makes family a big part of it.

“Going through the end of a company helped us a lot in knowing what we wanted out of the next company I started,” Barros said. “I say ‘we’ because I consider her a founder in the company. Your family (kids included) are co-founders and they have to be all in before you start or it ends up in a very bad place.”

Before getting started, the couple listed what they both wanted out of Moment, what was important to Gina and what Marc thought success would look like. He shared the list with his co-founders so everyone knew what mattered to him and his family before starting.

Shifting between problems that pop up throughout a day at work and at home is like a “Whack-a-Mole” game, Hamilton said. As a startup founder there was an incredible amount of pressure that felt like all the weight of the world on her shoulders. She called it anxiety inducing at times, and she firmly believes it causes mental health challenges — a claim called out in this recent report.

It’s a lot to expect a partner to stick around through, especially if that person is not wired in the same way.

“It’s a huge piece of your life that you have to give a ton of attention to, and your partner doesn’t quite understand, even if you have great communication,” Hamilton said.

She remembers a conversation with her then husband that happened about a year after Onvia’s IPO, and after the economy had crashed.

“I said, ‘How are we doing? I know it’s been really crazy. It’s been really busy and it’s been tense.’ And he said something like, ‘How much longer?’” Hamilton said. “And I remember thinking, ‘Well, it’ll get better, but what do you mean how much longer? This is who I am.’

“It was a daunting moment for me,” she added. “Because I realized I might not be able to have both of these things.”

Starting a new company after divorce, Hamilton almost found it easier to not have to compromise and negotiate with a partner in the house. But as a woman and a mom, she realized that she would always have two jobs — her professional career and her “big other job” of raising two kids.

“I joke about wanting a wife,” she said. “I mean, I hate how sexist that sounds across the board, but it also makes a really important point, which is that most men have a wife who helps and supports them, and even if that wife is working they’re doing that two-job thing. So it’s really complicated — the fact that I’m saying it was easier for me to do it solo than to do it with a partner is kinda twisted, right?”

She’s started companies and she’s started relationships, and both are full of love and learning and hard work and compromise and pain.

“It sounds romantic to be starting a company but it’s actually a lot of other things,” Hamilton said, before laughing and reflecting on her recent “freedom” from startup life. “Exiting a business is more romantic than exiting a relationship.”

You spend years preparing to retire. You plan carefully so you can afford to leave your job behind and enjoy your well-earned free time. But do you have a plan for how you’ll fill that time or who you will spend it with?

It’s not something to take for granted. Without careful planning, retirees are at risk for slipping into isolation, inactivity and poor health, says geriatrician Ronan Factora, MD.

“People look forward to retirement, but they haven’t really thought about how they’re going to spend their time,” he says. “They spend a lifetime doing nothing but work and don’t cultivate any other activities or social contacts.”

So take time to give it some thought. Dr. Factora advises thinking realistically about what you’re going to do all day.

“You cannot spend that time just sitting and watching TV,” he warns. “Everything declines if you’re sedentary.”

Evidence is mounting on the dangers of sitting too much: Your blood sugar, blood pressure, cholesterol, muscle tone and cognitive faculties all could suffer.

“Activity is the most important way to maintain your health and quality of life,” Dr. Factora says.

Staying connected to others is also vital. Your friends and family are more important than ever after you retire.

“It’s easy for loneliness to slip into clinical depression,” he notes. “And it’s hard to treat depression when the root cause is a lack of social support.”

He offers eight tips to help you plan for an active, engaged retirement:

1. Take stock of your family situation

Think about how much time you realistically can expect to spend with family every day.

Do you have adult children nearby who will have time to spend with you? Will you spend time caring for grandchildren? Do you have a spouse or other family member who requires care?

2. Consider the changing dynamics in your home life

If you’re married, think about how your retirement will affect your relationship.

If your spouse is already retired or is a homemaker, what will it be like for both of you to stay home all day? If your spouse is still working, will expectations change about things like cooking and cleaning?

3. Assess your interests

Start thinking about your hobbies — either things you’re already doing or things you’d like to try.

Hobbies that help you develop skills over time — playing an instrument, woodworking, art or crafts, for instance — are particularly rewarding and can help keep your mind sharp.

4. Plan to learn something new

Maybe now’s the time to go back and get that degree in art history or philosophy. Many colleges offer tuition discounts and waivers for older adults.

Or, if going back to college sounds a little too much like work, check out a local adult education program for less intense class offerings.

5. Consider using your skills in new ways

Are there part-time opportunities for teaching or consulting work in the field you’re retiring from? Are you interested in mentoring younger professionals in your field?

6. Diversify your social circle

As you age, you may face the loss of loved ones in your generation. Developing friendships with younger people helps you stay connected — and may offer fresh experiences and perspectives.

7. Consider community activities or volunteer opportunities

Start finding things to do in your community.

Libraries, religious organizations, community centers, senior centers and nonprofits that use volunteers are all places where you can get involved and meet new people.

8. Consider relocating if necessary

Does it make sense to move somewhere closer to your family or good friends? Or is moving to a community that has many other retirees a good idea?

With a little planning (beyond your finances), you can enjoy an active and engaging retirement that will keep you healthy — both physically and mentally — for years to come.

By JOHN SAKALA
The man of the moment Yo Maps is back with Kaleza hit another love song which is a continuation to his smash hit Finally where he featured Macky 2.

Yo Maps, the Kabwe based music producer, singer and song writer is still dominating  the music airwaves with his wedding hit Finally.

He says Kaleza (swear) is a continuation or a part two of Finally where after marriage the couple should be expecting conflicts but continue together.

Yo Maps 24, whose real name is Elton Mulenga said Kaleza is a beautiful love song infused dance hall which has a unique vibe attached to it.

The Kaleza song can be downloaded below.

https://tiozambia.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/Yo-Maps-Kaleza-Prod.-By-Yo-Maps.mp3